New Rig time Need some help...

[2cuteSue]

Ok, i been going over some things about price and vid cards and either amd or Intel....  I have loved my amd ive had for going on 5 years now... Still runs strong... here is what I been looking at  > http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6970963&CatId=2846

seeing how that comes all set up and tested and comes with a vid card I thought that was a pretty good buy....  BUT

i been wanting a liquid cooled system and wanting to try Intel... Sun Tzu showed me this other day and got my mouth watering, lol!!

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=7024175&Sku=B69-9012

granted tho that rig doesnt come with a vid card, hard drive, dvd drive .....  which would cost me 300 more on top of the 1000...

 

BUT, then i saw this as it is about the same system but only AMD....

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6951361&CatId=2846

 

Ok, now I got a couple questions...  if you have 8gb ram how much can u actually use gaming? I have 64 bit OS... so I am thinking only 4 ... but idk!!!

Also , with the last rig there the amd one, it has 6 cores.... so 6 cpu in it... where as the 1st 2 rigs are both quad core rigs....  What is the signifigance in having 6 cores as to 4..?  Does it share the load balance better?  or does the six core machine use all 6 or stop at 4 and use the other 2 for other purposes? 

Im still running a dual core now so this is all new to me and im trying to figure out my better deal...  Im going to be making payments on this thing till i get it so money is not the issue..... 

 

I know a big question is AMD or Intel, so bottom line what can XI tell me with my 3 choices here what you all think?

[ChknFngr]

i think liquid cooling can be good only if u know exactly what ur doing and u have the right parts, meaning it can cost a lot.

of course there is cheap liquid solutions, but honestly its nothing but a cheap solution.

 

i have a Noctua NH-D14 (not sure of the exact model), and let me tell you its a beast, its build like a tank, its enormous, but i never saw a system that cool. i mean the air that comes out of the case is way cooler than ambient air, its crazy.

but its so big that u have to be sure the case can accept it, that it wont get in the way with ram slots,...

here a pic i found of it

 

hmm seems i cant post a pic no more, nvm

 

well that i7 system seems like a good deal, u cant go wrong with that i7, i would go that way if i were you.

not that i dont like amd, but the i7 is awesome. and that liquid system u posted is one of the cheap solution i was talking about, its useless

[2cuteSue]

i was wondering bout that... i dont have a clue about liquid cooling...!!  all it says on the I7 intel rig is Performance Liquid Cooling... Then the Amd one says CoolIT ECO A.L.C. Liquid Cooling...  Then there is another AMD machine that is 100 cheaper and it has Cooler Master Hyper N520 Cooling in this rig http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=6896085&CatId=2846....  I dont know the difference in the cooling and how it works... Why is one better then the other?? 

 

 

[tsw 8.5]

did you look at the rigs new egg has

[WiZiD]

http://cgi.ebay.com/AMD-1090T-Six-Core-GTX-580-Black-Ops-Gaming-PC-Computer-/290503634030?pt=Desktop_PCs&hash=item43a35dac6e

I would need to know how much you can spend. There is a gaming rig on ebay....new

[ChknFngr]

they all cheap liquid solution, 

it may work jsut fine, just dont expect it to be better than a good heatsink+fan.

 

now for the rest, the one with evga motherboard and i7 look to me better than the others, but i dont know latest amd system that much.

all i know is that i7 875 is just fucking nice

i have the 870 2.93GHz, cant be more happy, i run it at 3.3GHz, its stable, cool and quiet

[wildthing]

One site I found useful and bought my current machine from was www.ibuypower.com check it out 2 cute and tell me what you think.

[Renegade45]

I use the Amd 6 core system i build my own systems from scratch... The barebones 6 core system is nice .... with dual ati radeon 5800's at 1920x1080 need to upadte my os to 7  but waiting till something happens cause this would then need a full system start over and i have to much on here to back up and put on externals first !  AMD and ATI systems make awesome rigs  and they are alot cheaper than Intel... but that is my opinion ... you have to make the choice!  Hope this Helps

[2cuteSue]

tsw 8.5

did you look at the rigs new egg has

 Ya, they were way overpriced for not so much of a rig!!!

[2cuteSue]

CHKN

they all cheap liquid solution, 

it may work jsut fine, just dont expect it to be better than a good heatsink+fan.

 

now for the rest, the one with evga motherboard and i7 look to me better than the others, but i dont know latest amd system that much.

all i know is that i7 875 is just fucking nice

i have the 870 2.93GHz, cant be more happy, i run it at 3.3GHz, its stable, cool and quiet

 really....  i thought a liquid cooled was better.... hmmmm   my amd i have went thru 3 cpu fans in 5 years..... I would like to get a I7 ...  i am trying to stay about 1000 bucks tho.... since im making payments anyway..... def no more then 1200.... lol

[ChknFngr]

u'll get cooler with a liquid system than with the stock intel fan for sure.

im just saying as u can see on this chart, that most liquid system dont equals good heatsink+fans

[Nobodygood>XI<]

 

I build systems, mostly for engineering or servers, so that stuff is all Intel

My home systems I have built have been AMD.

I can say that over the past 10 years I have built myself a new system every year until I built this one, I can't justify building one because this one works so well.

Right now it is over 2 years old. So this year I am going to get a new graphics card and that is it.

MSI K9A2 Platinum AM2+/AM2 AMD 790FX ATX AMD Motherboard

AMD Phenom 9950 Agena 2.6GHz Socket AM2+ 125W Quad-Core Black

OCZ Reaper HPC 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model

Now this is some old chit from computer standards, I am running an old ATI 3870 Graphics card and an OCZ 700 watt power supply

The only thing I am getting this year is a ATI 6850 graphics card and I bet it will be good for another year or two.

For many years the hardware was always the bottle neck with running the software that was being written.

Now days not so much other than graphics.

three things people always went cheap on and systems suffer for. Power Supply, RAM and Graphics cards.

The most over looked is the power supply, go cheap here and you will suffer.

If you want to spend the extra money the i7 is the processor to go with and buy a good quality motherboard, not the cheapest that will take the processor. I also think building your own system is far better than buying a packaged deal.

I have spent over 50,000.00 in computer equipment (not all for myself) at Newegg, and I don't see a reason to shop someplace else unless they don't have what I am looking for. The few times I shopped Tiger I was not impressed.

[Cavey]

Personally if money is an issue go for AMD..  You get more for your money.  Simple. 

 

I disagree with CHKN, in this day and age you don't need to know anything about liquid cooling to buy and install one.  I just bought the Corsair H70, it is a completely seeled unit.  When it comes, simply take it out the box, screw the fans and radiator to the case.  Plug in the fan power leads, and screw down the heat exchange onto the processor.  20 mintue job.  Cost is about $135, but you can get it cheaper in the States.  You would need a big case, but if your case is small then get it's smaller brother the H50.

[Bloodrain]

I like to approach this from a different point of view. What do you plan to use this for? What games? Black ops is only dx9 so nothing demanding there. If you are going to play the new BF then thats on dx10. If you are going to play the new MMOs out then some are on dx11.

 

First of all you need to decide your PC ability. Are you willing to take the time to spend to tweak and stabilize your system. Is this within your abilities? Do you have to learn this? Are you willing to? If not or don't have the time then, a prebult is better for you. I would suggest having a game rig built for you. If you buy a brand name prebuilt then it is usually full of bundle crap and is locked out of any tweaking.

 

How long do you keep your PC for, 2 yrs? 10yrs?

If a long time then getting more than you need now that's expandable to accept upgrades later is best. X58 mobo are ddr3 with 6 mem slots that can handle up to 24gig ram that you will never use but maybe in future so its nice to have that option. Since win7 wants 1gig to run smooth and your game doesn't use more than 1 gig, you could get away with 2 gig of good ram if only gaming and fast processor. I rec min of 4 gigs for reg use. Try putting a ram meter on your desktop and see how little ram is used when game is running. I have 8 gigs and rarely runs 25% of it under heavy gaming and hosting.

 

When you are gaming are you also doing other things with the PC?

This makes how much processing power you need important. Extreme dual cores can rival quad cores if set up right. Quad cores are more than enough too run anything out there. An i7 quad has hyperthread that makes it run like a 8core which unless you are running muli apps or monitors or rendering, you will never use it but will be good for future. Same thing applies to 6 cores. I built an i7 930 w/HT on x58 mobo 1366mhz socket  and 6gig ddr3 with 3 extra slots left open. Most of the time only 2 cores were even being used and ram was at 15%. It has a mid-range dx11 g-card but, this set up could add three more graphic cards, 18 more gigs of ram, could run multiple monitors in future. It runs a 1050 watts modular power supply that has power throttling to conserve when not needed, a very stable power set up.

 

Do you want to run a large monitor or tv?

This will be a factor for g-card and ram. the bigger you go the more you need.

 

Do you have good internet speed?

If you have a laggy net speed then no matter what, your system will stink. I run 62mbps dl and 20mbps ul. I don't have issues on my end and it's nice for hosting. It still sucks on other player end b/c it's then their slow speed that makes lag to me. A 15mbps net would be more than adequate if not sharing with others in the same house unless you are set as proprietary user. I know a lot of players have 7mbps or less and think it's fine, but they haven't run on higher to know the difference it makes. Get at least 5mbps ul also. The standard 1-2 mbps is min.

 

As for the liquid cooling, unless your are doing OC or extreme graphics you don't need liquid. I have gotten air to run very cold under high oc. Small fans are louder than large fans. 140mm fans move a lot more air quietly. The school of thought is if you have more processing and ram than you need then you don't have to OC. OC is to get more out of a system by putting the demmand on it. If you don't have the demmand then you don't need to OC. Don't skimp on the mobo in this case b/c higher end mobo are laid out better for air flow and have their own integrated surface heat disipation.  I built a very high end expandable system for xrg member Chewy for $1500 that he will never fill to the max options. Learn to route cables professionally. Looks nicer and helps air flow.

 

The last thing that's important.

The hard drive. Not super important in gaming as if doing multiple apps or video editing etc where fast hd access is needed. If you are looking to the future and not doing all kinds of other crap, just gaming, and not multiple games (over5 installed) you could run a 150gig raptor 10,000rpm hd. They are pretty affordable now. Use a second larger 7500rpm hd that's cheaper to store stuff on instead of clogging up your main HD. If boot up time makes you wet then spend too much money and get a SSD hd. The thing with them though is unless you are demanding with those other apps or video editing most of time not noticable change.

 

 

[2cuteSue]

ty ty .... appreciate the info there guys!!! 

[WolfTiS]

I am in agreement with Nobodygood>XI< about Newegg over Tiger Direct. I have built several systems and Newegg has always been better on parts. My brother bought one system from Tiger that they put together for him and had nothing but trouble with. After taking it to a local shop he found out that Tiger had put in some used parts including the cpu. So for myself I stay away from Tiger Direct. My system which I have listed in Xfire I built myself for around $1400 but that was when I7 first came out and the price has droped since then. I play Black Ops in our server with no lag what so ever.

[ChknFngr]

Cavey

Personally if money is an issue go for AMD..  You get more for your money.  Simple. 

 

I disagree with CHKN, in this day and age you don't need to know anything about liquid cooling to buy and install one.  I just bought the Corsair H70, it is a completely seeled unit.  When it comes, simply take it out the box, screw the fans and radiator to the case.  Plug in the fan power leads, and screw down the heat exchange onto the processor.  20 mintue job.  Cost is about $135, but you can get it cheaper in the States.  You would need a big case, but if your case is small then get it's smaller brother the H50.

u dont disagree with me, and i dont disagree with you.

fact is and u cant deny, a good heatsink+fan is better than your 'cheap' cooling system.

i dont say its bad, or hard to install, but its more expensive and not as much effective.

 

or u have to get a real liquid system, and thats not the same price and not easy to install.

 

a noctua keep the cpu cooler than a h70

and it also spread air of the whole case better than a cooling system, so it cool down other parts too.

the only way to get that efficiency is to get everything under liquid system, but that means it will cost a lot.

u'll have to get a liquid system for the video card too

[KTWEST]

Hey Too Cute

 

If I were looking to buy a new rig now check out Digital Storm. Got mine from them , they got a nice forum there that you can explore all the details with folks. I would also consider warantee to, some builders lack in that department. You can speck out one there,post it their forum and get a feed back. Also consider the distance and shipping cost when its time for repair. It all come down to your walet too. I just wish the place had weekend support. But it is in house not in India or some third party. Got 5 k in mine and I still stink! But I enjoy the hell out of it. Going on my third year with it and my warrentee will expire and I will be shipping it back for an upgrade. I will say this,I had a power supply and one video card go south but parts and labor were covered. They do a great job of emailng on your build progess or repair. If money was on object I would go with Falcon computers,damn $ though. But I think its 24/7 in house support. If I had the time I would and the know how I would build one myself. Digital Storm is located in California. They even have an option if your perfer to have your rig shipped in a crate. I would assume for people over seas. And that aint going to be cheap. Anyway give it a looksee.

[2cuteSue]

thanks KT.... will check it out!!!

[NightmareXI]

CHKN

Cavey

Personally if money is an issue go for AMD..  You get more for your money.  Simple. 

 

I disagree with CHKN, in this day and age you don't need to know anything about liquid cooling to buy and install one.  I just bought the Corsair H70, it is a completely seeled unit.  When it comes, simply take it out the box, screw the fans and radiator to the case.  Plug in the fan power leads, and screw down the heat exchange onto the processor.  20 mintue job.  Cost is about $135, but you can get it cheaper in the States.  You would need a big case, but if your case is small then get it's smaller brother the H50.

 

a noctua keep the cpu cooler than a h70

I had an H70 for a couple of weeks to test it....true is you have the same temps like a real good aircooled system

btw I am running a i5 750 at 4 Ghz with a Prolimatech Mega Shadow Apache Edition...

the noctua is at the same level like mine

 

also true is...you will get in trouble with the rest of the system if you dont have enough airflow in your case

I had my other temps going up while the H70 was installed

[Tball]

http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/landingpages/intel/i7/?gclid=CJya_tGAxqUCFcbd4AodMSs7Yw

 

[Cavey]

CHKN

Cavey

Personally if money is an issue go for AMD..  You get more for your money.  Simple. 

 

I disagree with CHKN, in this day and age you don't need to know anything about liquid cooling to buy and install one.  I just bought the Corsair H70, it is a completely seeled unit.  When it comes, simply take it out the box, screw the fans and radiator to the case.  Plug in the fan power leads, and screw down the heat exchange onto the processor.  20 mintue job.  Cost is about $135, but you can get it cheaper in the States.  You would need a big case, but if your case is small then get it's smaller brother the H50.

u dont disagree with me, and i dont disagree with you.

fact is and u cant deny, a good heatsink+fan is better than your 'cheap' cooling system.

i dont say its bad, or hard to install, but its more expensive and not as much effective.

 

or u have to get a real liquid system, and thats not the same price and not easy to install.

 

a noctua keep the cpu cooler than a h70

and it also spread air of the whole case better than a cooling system, so it cool down other parts too.

the only way to get that efficiency is to get everything under liquid system, but that means it will cost a lot.

u'll have to get a liquid system for the video card too

 

I do disagree with you, because you quoted, "I think liquid cooling can be good only if u know exactly what ur doing and u have the right parts, meaning it can cost a lot. Of course there is cheap liquid solutions, but honestly its nothing but a cheap solution"

 

This is simply untrue...  As the Corsair H70 is a self contained system, which needs zero maintenance, and is easy to install.  It is also cheap, being a tiny bit more expensive than the Noctua.  So it is a cheap, easy to install liquid cooling system, which apart from your one image is actually equal to the Noctua, when you read all the forums.  The other thing is, it also has 2 fans with a push/pull system, and moves the air around to cool other parts (just like the Noctua).  However it wouldn't matter as you always get other fans to pull in and push out air anyway (or you would be a fool not to).  Finally the other reason why I personally think the H70 is better is because most people don't want 400 tonnes sitting on their processor!!!  Also the power consumpsion of the Noctua is greater than the H70 which means is the long run it is more expensive.  Also due to the size you will need to make sure the case is big enough, if not you will need to put some more money aside to buy a new case.

 

Personally if you want to get an air cooled system the new Coolermaster V10 is awesome, and cools the memory dimms as well.

 

This is exactly why I disagree with you, because your statement is unfounded.

[7Toes]

damn it must to be nice to have the money for that we are barley keeping lights and internet on at my house im using a think 2002 old mouse i saved lol

[Sun Tzu]

Cavey

CHKN

Cavey

Personally if money is an issue go for AMD..  You get more for your money.  Simple. 

 

I disagree with CHKN, in this day and age you don't need to know anything about liquid cooling to buy and install one.  I just bought the Corsair H70, it is a completely seeled unit.  When it comes, simply take it out the box, screw the fans and radiator to the case.  Plug in the fan power leads, and screw down the heat exchange onto the processor.  20 mintue job.  Cost is about $135, but you can get it cheaper in the States.  You would need a big case, but if your case is small then get it's smaller brother the H50.

u dont disagree with me, and i dont disagree with you.

fact is and u cant deny, a good heatsink+fan is better than your 'cheap' cooling system.

i dont say its bad, or hard to install, but its more expensive and not as much effective.

 

or u have to get a real liquid system, and thats not the same price and not easy to install.

 

a noctua keep the cpu cooler than a h70

and it also spread air of the whole case better than a cooling system, so it cool down other parts too.

the only way to get that efficiency is to get everything under liquid system, but that means it will cost a lot.

u'll have to get a liquid system for the video card too

 

I do disagree with you, because you quoted, "I think liquid cooling can be good only if u know exactly what ur doing and u have the right parts, meaning it can cost a lot. Of course there is cheap liquid solutions, but honestly its nothing but a cheap solution"

 

This is simply untrue...  As the Corsair H70 is a self contained system, which needs zero maintenance, and is easy to install.  It is also cheap, being a tiny bit more expensive than the Noctua.  So it is a cheap, easy to install liquid cooling system, which apart from your one image is actually equal to the Noctua, when you read all the forums.  The other thing is, it also has 2 fans with a push/pull system, and moves the air around to cool other parts (just like the Noctua).  However it wouldn't matter as you always get other fans to pull in and push out air anyway (or you would be a fool not to).  Finally the other reason why I personally think the H70 is better is because most people don't want 400 tonnes sitting on their processor!!!  Also the power consumpsion of the Noctua is greater than the H70 which means is the long run it is more expensive.  Also due to the size you will need to make sure the case is big enough, if not you will need to put some more money aside to buy a new case.

 

Personally if you want to get an air cooled system the new Coolermaster V10 is awesome, and cools the memory dimms as well.

 

This is exactly why I disagree with you, because your statement is unfounded.

I replaced my V10 for this 

CoolIt Systems Domino A.L.C. Liquid CPU Cooler

http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-39083765508394_2135_600394058

with the V10 if you have ram that is to tall and you need to replace it you have to actually remove it to remove the ram.

So it sits in my closet I salvaged the fans of it.

[BANNPIRE]

the second one you posted sounds pretty sexy from the specs if i were u i would go with that i the n=mobo and cpu are beasts but the only thing is the gpu u might want to replace it plus just do research on the water cooler it easy to figure out ..i got one and did my home work its one of those thing that when u read up on it your like OHHHH OK I GET IT MAKES SENSE NOW LOLOL!