Canadian Train Wreck

[Shamu]

I have been surprised none of our Canadian friends posted this topic, it seems to be a constant topic on the web sites I visit.

 

Initially it seemed to be just a horrendous accident where the final death toll and loss of property is yet to be decided. I now see a criminal investigation has begun. Not sure the direction the investigation will take but it looks like a violation of corporate or state safety rules may be an important part.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/09/quebec-train-death-toll_n_3568464.html?ncid=webmail1

 

I am curiously following the news because because here in the States with regard to a corporate type "accident" rarely is an individual held accountable and only a financial settlement is imposed on the corporation.

 

I often think if there were some individual criminal responsibility for corporation failure we might be a lot safer in the workplace. It might inspire corporate management to do a better job.

 

PS: Hmmm.......I suppose the union side of me is showing. I am however bipolar, I also have a very conservative management side..

[JohnnyDos]

All I know is that train passed through Windsor Ontario where I live cause I see those tanker cars filled with fuel all the time when I go to the dog park.Plus they mentioned it on the news over here.What else can we say Shamu.Some how someone was careless and then we say "Shit Happens",Very unfortunate for those who died and also live in that area.

[hxtr]

From what I was reading... the train was not even being driving by a person if I read that right. 

 

I seen it is speculated that the breaks were disabled. The said some people were incinerated instantly. Crude oil I believe was the load. Wonder if someone was trying to make the oil prices go up?

 

Very sad for the life that was lost.. last count i read was 13. But look at the damage of that surrounding area. 

[JohnnyDos]

Here Shamu,this is what one guy wrote in our local paper:

 

n 2003 the Canadian Pacific Railway sold off the portion of its line that
runs east of Montreal through northern Maine to Portland to a private company
headquartered in Chicago known as the Montreal, Maine and Atlantic Railway. The
enterprise (like all well-run American enterprises headed by MBA types) was
almost completely levered, which meant after paying interest, bribes and
executive salaries didn’t have much left over to maintain the tracks. As the
tracks run close to country houses, and the locals sometimes walk on them. The
wood is rotten, the rails in bad shape, and there is grass where there should be
gravel in the road bed. They also use inferior equipment. In the particular case
in question, they used tank cars for explosive material (it could just as well
been something toxic like sulphuric acid) that are no longer permitted because
the walls are not at least one inch thick. But they got a variance which allowed
the company to ship oil in them until they were replaced, which in the case of
this company would have been never. Not surprisingly, when the train derailed in
the middle of a small town (which could have been Montreal or Portland, Maine
for that matter), they exploded.

 

The train, composed of 70 tank cars and five engines to draw them, had only
one engineer. This is also a variance, which they got from the Canadian
regulatory agency last year. I’d like you to imagine a heavily loaded train
carrying explosive or toxic materials going through your town with only one
person to make sure it gets through safely. At Nantes, QC, the engineer got off
the train to take a nap. He would be replaced by an American crew (of one!) to
take the train through Maine. The locomotive motors were left running to
maintain pressure in the air brake system. While he was napping one of the
engines caught on fire. A local noticed, and called the fire department, which
put the fire out. The breaks having failed, the train moved out of the station
on a grade that fell some 350 feet in 12 kilometers. By the time it reached the
town it was going close to 50 miles an hour into a curve that it had to take at
5 miles. The rest is history. It is hardly worth mentioning that the Company
President blamed the Nantes fire department.

 

The whole episode seems to me to sum up what has become of American
capitalism. Over-leveraged, shoddy product and performance, milking the
enterprise of its capital, and capturing regulators to get away with it. It is
the banking disaster writ small. In the mean time the investigators have found
only 5 bodies of the 60 to 80 that were incinerated in the center of town when
the train exploded.

[iEvil]

Newspaper in Sweden today said that railroad CEO blamed fireman's to the cause of accident. As they pulled out to put down the fire that occurred in the train engine, and by doing that they pulled the safety breaks on the train.

CEO said that they had proof, the one driving the train, before leaving it and put on the safety breaks.

And later on became a rolling oil bomb that wiped several city blocks and a nearby pub.

Edited July 10, 2013 by iEvil

[JohnnyDos]

Newspaper in Sweden today said that railroad CEO blamed fireman's to the cause of accident. As they pulled out to put down the fire that occurred in the train engine, and by doing that they pulled the safety breaks on the train.

CEO said that they had proof, the one driving the train, before leaving it and put on the safety breaks.

And later on became a rolling oil bomb that wiped several city blocks and a nearby pub.

See iEvil,now which story is true?Everybody wants to balame the other guy.I don't know myself,that story I posted came from my paper.

[Shamu]

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/world/americas/canada-runaway-train/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

 

I still wonder what accountability there will be. It should not be just bought off with the dollar, someone should be accountable.

 

We most certainly have yet to see the final death toll. Many may have been burnt to ashes and will never be found.

 

Sickening.

[loaderXI]

I have been waiting to see the out come but I seen in Maine only a few weeks maybe a month that a citizen watch group

in Maine were forming a human block-aid (picketing) to prevent this rail from entering and passing through with fuel tanker cars

 

 

So when I learned of this just made me wander  

 

here is a link to what I was talking about and by all means not sure there is ANY connection but

 

http://bangordailynews.com/2013/06/27/news/mid-maine/group-in-fairfield-planning-blockade-of-train-carrying-crude-oil/

[little_old_man]

It's reasons such as this is why they wanted to build a pipeline from Canada into the US. It's not only trains. This stuff is being moved on our highways too.

 

And to the writer of that newspaper article, crude oil IS NOT explosive. Yes it burns like a mutha fuka, but it does not explode in its raw form which is what was on the train.

 

Regardless of who was at fault, this was a horrible accident, and rather than looking for a scapegoat, they should be focusing on ways of preventing it from happening again. If the company that owns the railroad was a fault, they will pay through the nose. Making comparisons to "ALL" of corporate America is simply insulting.

[little_old_man]

Well, now it looks like the Canadian engineer lied about setting the hand brakes before heading off to a motel and is being detained.

 

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/10/19396092-railway-worker-suspended-in-quebec-train-crash-chief?lite=

[loaderXI]

Pops this modern Days and as you say regardless this was horrific and with out a shadow of doubt preventable 

 

 

Who ever was at fault will live with the results of this for the rest of there lives and we all can only hope that

measures are put fourth to prevent this from happening...To me it could have been anything on that train..

 

A runaway is a runaway and just as deadly

 

 

I lived in between to refineries 1 was heating oil and petro the other plant was jet fuel...While servicing a storage tank

they caused a massive explosion and fire that burned for 3 days 1/4 mile from my house

 

Conoco Phillips in Trainer

1998: A tank fire rocks the refinery in October as nearly 700,000 gallons of jet fuel burns, but there are no serious injuries. )

 

 

Also here is a list of recorded pipeline failures since 2000

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pipeline_accidents_in_the_United_States_in_the_21st_century

[PimpedOutPete]

This story has been dominating our news Shamu. This is a huge tragedy and what makes it worse is its not over yet. They still don't have a solid number on how many lost their lives. Families and friends still don't know where their loved ones are.

 

Maybe its different for people on this side of the border. At this moment, are hearts and thoughts as a nation go out to those who lost love ones. Our minds seems to be preoccupied with that thought rather than who and why this happened. Eventually as a nation. we will ask those questions... But now, we are just in shock by the magnitude of this...

[RIP>XI<]

at this time have 20 death  and over 40 uncovered persons grrrrr

[Joe Canadian]

This is a big tragedy for all of us

[DEEJAYKEG]

It is appalling, in my view, that there are people being reported as casting blame for this horrific incident before a proper

enquiry has been completed.  The press reports that the centre of town is still being treated as a crime scene - that infers

investigations are ongoing.

 

The last prosecution for failings in health and safety on the railway that cost seven lives here, cost the network operator

over £3m in fines and costs.  http://www.rail-reg.gov.uk/server/show/ConWebDoc.10395

 

I guess that similar laws exist in Canada?

[WANTED]

We have a bill here called  C-45, It allows the government to go after every one who undertakes, or has the authority, to direct how another person does work or performs a task. It establishes a legal duty for all persons directing the work of others to take reasonable steps to ensure the safety of workers and public. 

[Shamu]

We have a bill here called  C-45, It allows the government to go after every one who undertakes, or has the authority, to direct how another person does work or performs a task. It establishes a legal duty for all persons directing the work of others to take reasonable steps to ensure the safety of workers and public. 

But will they actually exercise the law?

 

I expect only financial resolution and no criminal charges entailing jail time.

[3rdCdnInfty]

My thoughts go out to all the friends and family's who lost loved ones that day

Edited July 11, 2013 by Cimon

[iEvil]

 

Newspaper in Sweden today said that railroad CEO blamed fireman's to the cause of accident. As they pulled out to put down the fire that occurred in the train engine, and by doing that they pulled the safety breaks on the train.

CEO said that they had proof, the one driving the train, before leaving it and put on the safety breaks.

And later on became a rolling oil bomb that wiped several city blocks and a nearby pub.

See iEvil,now which story is true?Everybody wants to balame the other guy.I don't know myself,that story I posted came from my paper.

 

Thats the thing with Media, you cant say whats true and what isnt. Luckily I hope they find the black box, so we all can know or slightly imagine what went wrong and who to blame.

 

As for oil price scam event its only a slight chance that would happen in the States. Possible if the oil actually came from US soil, otherwise OPEC controls the oil market, except from GB and Norway (if remember it right?)

Edited July 11, 2013 by iEvil